Pid Rslogix Manual

RSLogix 5000 programming packages help you maximize effectivity, save problem enchancment time, and improve productiveness. This book gives an in depth overview of the Logix platform along with ControlLogix, CompactLogix, and SoftLogix and explains the quite a few modifications launched in Studio 5000. Jul 05, 2011  In the SLC PID function, you use the control variable, reading it in Auto and writing to it in Manual. The PID remains enabled at all times, so that in Manual mode, it reverses the calculation to make the integral sum track the PV and CV. When the PID is switched to Auto, the PID initially calculates the same output from the current sum.

Flip into proficient in setting up PLC choices in Constructed-in Construction from the underside up using RSLogix 5000

About This BookIntroduction to the Logix platform and Rockwell Automation terminology, with belongings obtainable online inside the literature libraryBuild precise-world Rockwell Automation choices using ControlLogix, CompactLogix, SoftLogix, RSLogix 5000, and Studio 5000Understand the numerous controllers and sort parts on the market inside the ControlLogix and CompactLogix platforms, and the present modifications beneath the model new Studio 5000 Automation Engineering and Design software suite
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This book is for PLC programmers, electricians, instrumentation techs, automation professionals with main PLC programming info, nevertheless no info of RSLogix 5000. In case you’re a scholar who’s acquainted with automation and need to research RSLogix 5000 with minimal funding of time, that’s the book for you.

What You Will LearnBriefly uncover the historic previous of Rockwell Automation and the evolution of the Logix platformDiscover the complete differ of ControlLogix and ComplactLogix controllers and sort parts obtainable as we converse, and the necessary factor points it’s essential to take into consideration whenever you’re engineering a Rockwell Automation solutionExplore the essential factor platform modifications launched with Studio 5000 and Logix Designer mannequin 24 and the most recent firmware versionsGet to grips with the modules obtainable inside the ControLogix, SoftLogix, and CompactLogix platformsUnderstand writing Ladder Logic (LL) routines, Sequential Carry out Chart (SFC) routines, and Structured Textual content material routines (ST)Design Carry out Block Diagrams (FBD) and their simple integration with HMIs

In Factor

RSLogix 5000 and Studio 5000's Logix Designer are user-nice interfaces used for programming the current period of Rockwell Automation Controllers along with ControlLogix, CompactLogix, and SoftLogix. When engineering automation choices using Logix, it is important to evaluation the modifications to the platform launched with Studio 5000 and the numerous controllers, modules, and sort parts on the market as we converse. RSLogix 5000 programming packages help you maximize effectivity, save problem enchancment time, and improve productiveness.

This book gives an in depth overview of the Logix platform along with ControlLogix, CompactLogix, and SoftLogix and explains the quite a few modifications launched in Studio 5000. A clear understanding of the present Logix platform modifications is important for anyone making a Rockwell Automation reply. It provides a easy-to-adjust to, step-by-step technique to learning the essential Logix hardware and software parts and provides freshmen with a robust foundation inside the Logix platform choices and terminology. By the highest of this book, you will have a clear understanding of the capabilities of the Logix platform and the facility to navigate the Rockwell Automation Literature Library Belongings.

Style and technique

A step-by-step technique to RSLogix 5000, which is outlined in a easy-to-adjust to sort. Each matter is outlined sequentially with detailed explanations of the important and superior choices of Rockwell Automation that attraction to the needs of readers with quite a lot of experience.

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This is the first time I am trying to use a RSLogix 5000 PID and my lack of understanding this is version of a PID instruction is driving me crazy.I am trying to control temperature ( avg. Of 2 thermocouples ) using a proportional steam valve ( primary heat with the secondary (heating) fluid being 30% glycol.My main problem is getting the PID configured/scaled correctly.I am at the end of development and thought I would simulate the PIDs before shipping, to get a feel for how they respond.However, I can’t get it to do anything except slam on and off.This very well could be due to my P and I setting, since I can’t figure what the values are relative to ( max/min PV scaling?, eng units?, DINT? ) but my lack of understanding ( and ability to decipher the available help ) goes deeper than that with this PID instruction.So. Mainly working on PIDTEMP in “Heating”I scale, in the PLC, the HMI temp set point to –346 to 2192 = 0 to 16383 ( type j thermocouple limits) and move that to PIDTEMP.SP, fine and well.My process variable (DRYSHELFTEMPAVGPID) is from temp inputs also scaled (in PLC) 0-16383.My Control variable is assigned to an analog out (Local:7:O.Ch1Data ) configured to 4-20 Ma.I had an arbitrary P of 300 and I of 100.I set up a couple to test bits to toggle on and off as required to enable the PID and allow me to write new temperature feed back. First attempt had no PID internal scaling set.This would respond to a difference of set point vs. Feedback by slamming the output (CV) on or off.

At least it goes in the right direction.I then noticed that I had no scaling set, so I set max/min PV 16383 to 0. Same results. I recently went through this with a temperature control PID.First, the 5000 PID doesn't assume anything. Make sure you go through the config tabs and set the scaling. There's a CV scaling that hides back there.Use the same scaling for PV and SP. Use 0-100 (%) for output, to help troubleshooting.

Also scale your output card channel to 0-100.Your 'slamming' is because you have the gain set to an ungodly high value. Unless I know beforehand, I usually start 'slow' with a gain of 1, and an integral of.5. After it's enabled, you can watch the loop and tune it for best performance.I have found with PIDs, unless you know the exact behavior of every component in the process, start with the minimum config. Add to itif you need to. Starting complicated will make you a very frustrated programmer.My earlier topic on my experience:http://www.plctalk.net/qanda/showthread.php?t=26743.

I think you may be overcomplicating things. The CLX PID instruction can handle everything in REAL engineering values so you should not need to have any complicated scaling. This is much simpler than the SLC/Micrologix setup. I would also point out that your Prop Gain is far too high ( by a factor of 100 at a guess). Once again the PID terms should be entered in eng. Finally, in CLX you need to set up some kind of clock to call the PID instruction at the required interval.

Have you done this?Andybr. Thanks!I figured I could try to zip it to size but was booted from the office.What instruction help that there is states.PV unscaled maximum:Enter a maximum PV value (.MAXI) that equals the maximum unscaled value received from the analog input channel for the PV value.And as the analog input configuration choices include 'scaled for PID' I assumed that would be a good choice. This gives me a 0-16383 value foe my input. I also assumed that that the PID instruction should be operating with a 0-16383 range.

As such a P gain of around 300 would be a nice lowish starting point. Or so I thought.I will re config my temp in to eng units and my analog outs to 0-100, and gains down a 1.0 and.5.I will have to re-do all the effected HMI display readings that are effected but that is ok as long as the PID works.If I bring my PV into the PID in Eng units, what should I do to the Eng unit field in the instruction?

I will set both to –346 to 2192 and see what happens.As far as a clocking the thing, I assumed that just enabling the instruction with pre-conditions would kick it on. I will have to look into that part.Thanks.attached is the prelimenary version. I haven't incorperated any of the sugestions yet. JbjbjIn order for the PID instruction to evaluate at the required intervals you must have some form of clock. There are a number of ways to do this but the most common are:-i) Put the PID instruction in a scheduled task with the task interval set at the desired value.ii) Use a timer to generate a clock pulse at the desired interval.i) is more accurate but ii) is more flexible if you have many loops with different required intervals.

In either case you must also enter the interval you are using into the PID instruction. If you simply place the instruction on a rung in your main routine it will evaluate on every scan but will assume that each scan time is the value you enter in the PID dialog.Andybr. Thanks Andybr.I was getting myself more confused it seems.I thought the SWM would be a way to move different outputs to the analog out depending on the pre-conditions.I wont use that but1- run the PID all the time ( I assume adding a pulse as the PID pre-condition does that)2- buffer the PID out to a new tag3- move either a value ( usually 0 but I may add a pre-heat stage of 10-20% open) or the PID new buffer value to the analog output, with the move chosen by the former pre-conditions.Thanks!.edit. hmm, this may wind up the PID.

Also move a temperary SP to keep the PID output off? And as the analog input configuration choices include 'scaled for PID' I assumed that would be a good choice. This gives me a 0-16383 value foe my input.that “scaled for PID” choice is more applicable to Allen-Bradley’s SLC platform. It ALWAYS and MUST work on a range of 0 to 16383 for optimum control. Since the 1769-IF8 module that you’re using for your analog input can also be used with SLC systems, the 0 to 16383 “scaled for PID” range is included in the module’s setup. Your CLX platform has much more flexibility in its PID configuration.I also assumed that that the PID instruction should be operating with a 0-16383 range. As such a P gain of around 300 would be a nice lowish starting point.as others have already told you, 300 is WAY TOO HIGH.

1.00 is much more reasonable to get started. It’s very rare to see a Proportional setting much higher than 14.00 or so - but it does happen in some types of systems. Rule of thumb: if your Proportional setting is much higher than about 3.00 or 4.00 then something MIGHT be wrong.

Again - this is JUST a “rule of thumb” - so don’t get hung up on it. Sort of like “my new car gets 350 miles per gallon”. Well, MAYBE it does. But that number sure sounds fishy doesn’t it?Hopefully someone here has some experience with the 5000 PID (dependent version) and might be able to point me in the right direction.here you mentioned the “dependent version” - but the file you posted is set for the “independent version”. This can be a MAJOR source of confusion. Survival tip: IF (big IF) you’re already sort-of-kind-of familiar (or better yet, VERY familiar) with the “dependent gains” equation from some other PLC platform, then set your PID equation for “dependent gains” before you go any further. Here’s just one MAJOR issue along these lines:with the “dependent” setting you must use a SMALLER NUMBER to get MORE Integral action.with the “independent” setting you must use a BIGGER NUMBER to get MORE Integral action.plus the relative values of the Integral setting numbers are very different.and as Andybr pointed out, you definitely DO need SOMETHING to “clock” the PID.

Note that in the SLC system, you do NOT use a “clock” or “trigger” instruction on the PID rung. If you’re more familiar with the SLC/MicroLogix platforms, then this might be causing some of your confusion.back to the “clock” or “trigger” idea.

As others have said, this can be done by putting the PID in a periodic task. Or it can be done by using a timer’s Done bit to “trigger” the PID instruction. Survival tip: just use the simpler “timer done bit trigger” idea - and be sure to set the PID’s “Loop Update Time” setting to match the timer’s interval.

ALWAYS KEEP THOSE SETTINGS MATCHED.but if you decide to go the “Periodic Task” route, be sure to set the PID’s “Loop Update Time” setting to match the task’s periodic interval. ALWAYS KEEP THOSE SETTINGS MATCHED.going forward: keep posting your files. That’s the best way to get this thing nailed down.

This project sounds like a lot of fun. I just wish that I had more time to help.

Rest assured that you have plenty of qualified help here at the forum.good luck with your project. I've been reading some of the responses here and in another thread. My experience may be different, but in the thread I linked to above, my PID instruction has no trouble with using scaled engineering values. As long as the number is positive, I believe a number is just a number to the PID. Of course, the SP and PV have to be scaled the same.Also, I didn't use a clock pulse. There is an update time in the istruction, and I used that.

It is working properly.This was on a 1756-L61. I didn't realize there was that much difference between contrologix and compactlogix processors. Greetings tomalbright.you said:Also, I didn't use a clock pulse. There is an update time in the istruction, and I used that. It is working properly.well, if it's working I won't argue with success. But you might want to take a look at the two posts which start here (tried to show that under certain conditions (varying scan times, etc.) the loop may intermittently 'detune' itself if the 'trigger' event isn't properly set up.also the numbers that are used for the Integral and Derivative settings can seem 'way-out-of-whack' when the 'trigger' event isn't properly used.incidentally, I've seen several instances where people have complained about 'calculated' or even 'autotuned' values for PID tuning which were 'way-out-in-left-field' and totally useless.

In many cases, the reasons that the calculated and recommended values didn't work was that the PID wasn't being triggered correctly. Hopefully that idea is adequately brought out in the second post - about Bubba's paycheck.but then - back to reality.as long as the processor's scan time doesn't vary that much - and as long as no one really cares about the 'weird' PID settings (for Integral and Derivative action) - then everything can simmer along just fine with no problems.that's probably what's happening in your case. And once again, I have no intention of arguing with success. Obviously you've got enough PID experiece behind you to make the system perform correctly.but still, I just feel more comfortable in telling our new friend jbjbj to stay more in line with 'generally recommended' practices. At least until he's gained enough experience to know when the 'rules' can be safely 'bent'. OK, I have been back through the documentation and I see what you mean. My scan time is pretty fast, so maybe that is taking care of it.

I set the loop update time for 10 seconds, but I believe because of the way I have it set up, I am updating every scan. It's a temperature control, so a very slow process update. I'll have to change a few things to see how it acts. Even though it seems OK, I understand what you were getting at in the other thread, and I'd rather err on the side of caution by configuring it correctly.Configuring it the way I did was an old habit. All a little different, and Contrologix is even more different. I'm learning in spite of myself!

Ideally the PID would be working with infinite resolution to simulate an analog PID. Unfortunately this is not possible with digital systems.IAs long as the number is positive, I believe a number is just a number to the PID.You want to scale your PID properly so that you take advantage of all the resoltion available. High resolution feedback and constant sampling times allows one to be more aggressive when using the derivative gains when derivative gains are required.The PIDs should be clocked properly as Ron advises. This allows one to calculate PID gains when plant parameters can be determined. If the PIDs are not clocked properly the auto tuning software will never work correctly. Okay,I got this thing working in the shop.

(stand alone controls, not total system)The following was my version applicable to a compact logix 1769-L31 PLC with 1769 modules using RSLogix 5000 (v15). If RS5000 is used for Control Logix PLCs and modules or the 1769 modules are used with MicroLogix and RSLogix 500, things WILL be different.As noted by tomalbright, there are substantial differences between compact logix ( micro logix ) and control logix modules. The 1769 analog out modules don’t have the jiffy configuration tool ( or as many options when configured via “data monitor” ) and as such I couldn’t configure the output as 0-100 = 4-20MaPerhaps, this wasn’t the best way (I didn’t want to re-scale some things used for other purposes) but here is how I set up PIDTEMP.Process Variable: (in this case the average of 2 thermocouples) The thermocouple channels are configured for PID data format, type j, deg f.Control Variable: directly to analog out channel, Local:7:O.Ch1Data. This channel configured for, range = 1- 4-20Ma, dataFormat = 2, PID.SetPoint: DRYTEMPSETHMI, read straight from the HMI and moved into PIDTEMP.SP.

Entered and read as Deg f. No conversions or such.PID Setup Dialogs: ( This version of the program was captured/saved while active, thus some values are shown that normally are blank but are being displayed here as the PID ramps up)Tuning Tab: Pgain,.02, (As noted by others, my initial values were way to large and based on my previous Omron CX1 project)Reset Time:.05.Derivative Rate: 0. ( As always these will be field tuned on start-up)Config Tab: Dependant ( I must have mouse wheeled it to independent in the first set up, Side note: most mouse wheel function are disabled in RS5000 but not this)SP-PVDerivative of = PV (default, not using here)Loop update.25 sec ( maybe much faster than needed )CV High 100CV low 0Deadband 0Alarms: not using atmScaling:PV: unscaled max = 16383Unscaled min = 0 ( this is set to match the DataFormat of the analog IN card )Eng Units max = 2193Eng Units min = -346 ( eng unit range of my type j thermo couples in Deg f.

)CV: unscaled max = 16383Unscaled min = 0 ( this is set to match the DataFormat of the analog OUT card )Tieback: max; 100, min 0 ( I didn’t enable tieback but these values appear when “online” and I couldn’t change them to play with )As recommended, I now clock the PID instruction all the time (maybe to fast for a temp loop ) and also set/unset PIDTEMP.SWM ( PID software manual mode ) as required with pre-conditions. ( I had some no longer present test bits for that.)I treat the Vacuum level PID different in that I don’t enable it until the vac pump hits setpoint level and then introduce an “air bleed” which I will try to regulate vacuum with.And the Condenser cooling flow loop is also different, it only regulates flow to 20 GPM.( This loop is stupid, it has no user set ability and always maintains 20 GPM flow. It should have just used a manual flow control valve but I could not convince the process engineer of this. It is just an unnecessary expensive complication. IMHO there are quite a few things not needed and some missing from this mechanical design but I’m sure we all feel that way at times.

)I had warned my boss that I was stuck on the last programming item (PID setup) and and the cost of getting “free” help would be posting the program publicly and sharing the results. So here it is. (disclamer this works in the shop as a stand alone control panel but won’t be field started for a month or 2 )Thanks for the help!!!

Okay,I got this thing working in the shop. (stand alone controls, not total system)The following was my version applicable to a compact logix 1769-L31 PLC with 1769 modules using RSLogix 5000 (v15). If RS5000 is used for Control Logix PLCs and modules or the 1769 modules are used with MicroLogix and RSLogix 500, things WILL be different.As noted by tomalbright, there are substantial differences between compact logix ( micro logix ) and control logix modules.

The 1769 analog out modules don’t have the jiffy configuration tool ( or as many options when configured via “data monitor” ) and as such I couldn’t configure the output as 0-100 = 4-20MaPerhaps, this wasn’t the best way (I didn’t want to re-scale some things used for other purposes) but here is how I set up PIDTEMP.Process Variable: (in this case the average of 2 thermocouples) The thermocouple channels are configured for PID data format, type j, deg f.Control Variable: directly to analog out channel, Local:7:O.Ch1Data. This channel configured for, range = 1- 4-20Ma, dataFormat = 2, PID.SetPoint: DRYTEMPSETHMI, read straight from the HMI and moved into PIDTEMP.SP. Entered and read as Deg f. No conversions or such.PID Setup Dialogs: ( This version of the program was captured/saved while active, thus some values are shown that normally are blank but are being displayed here as the PID ramps up)Tuning Tab: Pgain,.02, (As noted by others, my initial values were way to large and based on my previous Omron CX1 project)Reset Time:.05.Derivative Rate: 0. ( As always these will be field tuned on start-up)Config Tab: Dependant ( I must have mouse wheeled it to independent in the first set up, Side note: most mouse wheel function are disabled in RS5000 but not this)SP-PVDerivative of = PV (default, not using here)Loop update.25 sec ( maybe much faster than needed )CV High 100CV low 0Deadband 0Alarms: not using atmScaling:PV: unscaled max = 16383Unscaled min = 0 ( this is set to match the DataFormat of the analog IN card )Eng Units max = 2193Eng Units min = -346 ( eng unit range of my type j thermo couples in Deg f. )CV: unscaled max = 16383Unscaled min = 0 ( this is set to match the DataFormat of the analog OUT card )Tieback: max; 100, min 0 ( I didn’t enable tieback but these values appear when “online” and I couldn’t change them to play with )As recommended, I now clock the PID instruction all the time (maybe to fast for a temp loop ) and also set/unset PIDTEMP.SWM ( PID software manual mode ) as required with pre-conditions.

( I had some no longer present test bits for that.)I treat the Vacuum level PID different in that I don’t enable it until the vac pump hits setpoint level and then introduce an “air bleed” which I will try to regulate vacuum with.And the Condenser cooling flow loop is also different, it only regulates flow to 20 GPM.( This loop is stupid, it has no user set ability and always maintains 20 GPM flow. It should have just used a manual flow control valve but I could not convince the process engineer of this. It is just an unnecessary expensive complication. IMHO there are quite a few things not needed and some missing from this mechanical design but I’m sure we all feel that way at times. )I had warned my boss that I was stuck on the last programming item (PID setup) and and the cost of getting “free” help would be posting the program publicly and sharing the results.

So here it is. (disclamer this works in the shop as a stand alone control panel but won’t be field started for a month or 2 )Thanks for the help!!!Bumping an old thread instead of starting a new one.What is the UNSCALED Mnemonic of the Control variable (CV) and the Scaled Mnemonic for the CV.I M LOOKING FOR A 0-16383 Value representing the 0-100% output AND I AM MISSING IT.

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